But one thing I know, we have a choice in our behaviors. Here are some points of summary that I wrote about why this matters: From some of the background reading on this issue, it is clear that digital documents, audio, and video can constitute relevant evidence in any of these legal actions. Hybels led many. This makes my blood boil. I do. tax. But on the wider scope, I asked the folks a work today if they knew what was happening at Willow Creek. Keeping this in the forefront of out thoughts should help us from becoming disappointed when another pastor is caught. Hey WCCC, set up an 800 number with an outside firm so anyone with information can call without fear of being shamed on stage or in the press. and further question.. It is clear to me that God did not want this hidden any longer. Agreed. he shoveled my walkway and came to the neighborhood potlucks? @ Headless Unicorn Guy: Where I work we are required to use the company secure email system if sending high or moderate risk information (e.g., social security numbers, credit card numbers, student records, health information). And while Hybels coached men to abide by the so-called "Billy Graham rule"never being alone with a women he was not married tohe often broke that rule, according to the Tribune. Because TWW doesnt have a tick the box to be notified of future comments, and because my comments seem to go live straight away, I have often felt unconfident that the TWW team or people I have replied to in a comments thread at TWW have noticed my comments. Sounds like at least some of the accusers would like to see justice for sure, but also redemption for even Hybels. Very sad indeed. Put a frog in a pot,with boiling water and the frog knows to jump out, but if the water is a slow boil, the frog with stay and finally be boiled. Because I handled it in the moment (As she did with her push away response to Hybels) And it worked. By the time you get there, youve probably already been compromised yourself, youve supported a lot of evil things, youve shouted down others who were only trying to get at the truth (as I once did, alassorry, Adam, you were right and I was wrong, pastor really was up to no good), and its not easy to extricate yourself or your family. Given the complexity and amount of ongoing business involved in a multi-million-dollar, multi-campus enterprise, I would thank that their legal counsel would have ensured that documents (including emails) from all board members, staff, and other employees would need to be preserved, in case of legal/criminal issues arising. For the whole world-system, based as it is on mens primitive desires, their greedy ambitions and the glamour of all that they think splendid, is not derived from the Father at all, but from the world itself. (1 John 2:16 Phillips), And then theres this: she either did or didnt inform her husband immediately 1. And to think that Willow Creek notables have been hanging out with him! We sat under their leadership at Willow Creek for several years and were sad when the Ortbergs left to California. And actually, it was the Holy Spirit that empowered Peter to be so bold that made it happen. I dont want to think poorly of John Ortberg too. And then maybe they see it happening, confront the guy, he says understood and suddenly you and your husband are out of a job. Might I suggest this might more accurately say that sexual predation is not always based on wanting to have sex? Wow. I read it Daily and Journal too. I read it that Jesus was doing the moderating. Theres been so much of this lately that I think (hope!) Jesus healed that man and told Peter to stow it. Children The couple has two children. Association of Related Churches I hope your eyes are one day opened. I dont know what mainstream is for this topic. OK. Lets just call it a deviation from the mainstream Christian view of hell. The sheer resources at these (mostly) mens disposal. At TWW, comments become a place of learning and exposure. And, no, it does not minimize their words concerning what Bill Hybels has done. Actually, hugging creates a release of oxytocin (also known as the cuddle hormone) in the human body, which can artificially create a sense of trust and closeness. Bye! I know. Jesus wins. Thanks, Julie! You did nothing to invite such horrors of sexual abuse. WC is Hybels no matter how much they protest. Or, for instance, a pastor may be forever fishing to see what his parishioners know as to the latest church scandal, etc., without the trusting individuals ever even know this is taking place. 3 comments are deleted. The Devil is destroying yet another church. Position? (That last one is pure fun in a mega church because you have to trust the elders/boards. He may or may not have been directly abusing his own wife, but he surely was abusing the women in his church who he targeted. In the fallout of Hybels's departure over sexual misconduct allegations, the esteemed megachurch lost other top leaders: The church's elders, as well as Steve Carter and Heather Larson, who were. Dear TWW readers, I am in Australia so I comment and tweet and post things on FB when you are asleep if you are in the USA. I have said his actions with women have been wrong and they are disqualifying for a man of the Gospel. As I said before, I think people who disbelieve the testimony of victims are the least credible people in these situations.. When one person has an experience like this with a trusted friend and spiritual leader, they typically dont know how to make sense of it. Dee, my Sister Nancy Beach sent me this today. The issue with those who had represented themselves before God and man as being in a place of spiritual authority with the responsibility tojudgment were made public spin). You get a time out. You watch a kid in a souped up car on the highway darting in and out at excessive speeds and say I hope he gets picked up.. Source: www.dailyherald.com. @ Bridget: Ive been to Ephesus and it is just a tourist destination. Those are, in my opinion, less the goals than the tools used to achieve the real goals, which I am guessing are not the spiritual health of the Body of Christ. Im probably sensitive about this because Ive seen the this is what you get for being an egalitarian on social media and it drives me nuts. I also think if its true, it minimizes his and his wifes ability to legitimately point the finger at others, and the impact of their words, and that is very unfortunate. Kids will tell you straight up, but I kind of treat them like stray cats and let them come to me! I am an infrequent commenter here, but have been following the WW for years. What we have a problem with is a man who by his own admission did a lot of untoward things, things that are the very definition of a sexual groomer, and did so behind the scenes while maintaining the aura of one who should be emulated. there was no hostile work environment attached. Creepy hug? It was always funny to me (sad really) how when Bill Hybels prayed for/about something no matter what it was, that according to Hybels God always answered him immediately or within days. In 1974, Bill Hybels married Lynne while he was still a youth pastor. Bill and Lynne Hybels draw on their own personal experience and a guiding faith to offer practical advice on how to enjoy a lifetime of togetherness -- from finding a suitable mate and dealing with the most common marital problems to avoiding the pitfalls that can sabotage a healthy relationship. We cant imagine the immensity of it all. Honest to Pete until this very discussion I thought that this was just the way that decent people behave. Once again, that is left in the capable Hands of our Father. It is when people naively do not realize that everyone has an agenda, not to be cynical, that they fail to ask important questions and perform essential (to them!) The whole manipulation tactic is a brain gamer based upon the receivers cognitive dissonance. How many do you want, Brad? Kind of surprised it was allowed to stand without edit or response. Come Lord Jesus! Some will walk away all together from their faith journey. These people have patience for the long con. So were other women who were dealing with this privately. We are as busy as they; Standing Ovations: Whats the Difference Between Highpoint Church and Willow Creek Community Church, Some Thoughts on Supposedly Feminist Men Who Reportedly Abuse/Harass Women | futuristguy, http://www.divorceminister.com/nancy-ortberg-shares-her-side-rebill-hybels-allegations/, https://vondadyer.weebly.com/blog/vonda-dyers-statement-re-chicago-tribune-and-bill-hybels, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sa0EtdtPi8w, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hv72Q23lIp0, https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bKkOke2noyc, https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FLT3Cb96-Mk, https://www.lighthousetrailsresearch.com/blog/?p=28151%5D, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serpent_seed. The kids tried to sue the board to no avail. Electronic medical records are a good example of confidentiality in action. I dont have any memory of doing and saying those things to her that night!. I know that unwanted full frontal hugs was a part of abusive pastors manipulations of women in a small rural church. Ill assume you mean well and are somewhere back in that stage where youre still denying. Thus, this person offering an opinion that things may have been taken wrong in Hybels case is one thing, but offering up details/takes on her say-so on action of J Ortberg putting him in less than a flattering light appears at first blush to potentially be from the wagon-circling camp which in and of itself is why many dont speak out instantly. Sad! I do wonder what the men exchanging holy kisses in bible times did for their brains. Leaders who walk in the dark are not representing Jesus but rather the same Devil the original Pharisees did. I wonder when the above reproach inspectors will engage and be welcome with open arms; they may want to hurry, as its reached the secular media, and theyre not too focused on 1 Peter 4:8. Dee, I was wondering how you got him to do that gig. I guess you are not aware of the president for whom Hybels was a spiritual advisor. This is a well worn story, insert Pastor name here, insert church name here. It never ceases to amaze me that the Pew sitters continue on without ever demanding to see a detailed budget. I mean, it makes for good gossip too. Excellent comment! Ive experienced it alsomultiple times. Nothing really bad happened. Though Lynne had intended to become a social worker, she did not hesitate to commit her life to church ministry, convinced that God has given the local church a clear mandate to address the needs of "the whole person in the whole world." Instead, these women were displayed like his leadership trophies. Which is why the Internet is SATANIC WITCHCRAAAAAFT and their on-lookers are the WITCHES! In her statement Monday, Niequist said she remains "in relationship with my dad." "I love him, & I always will. In the book, Turn the Ship Around David Marquet writes: Leadership should mean giving control rather than taking control and creating leaders rather than forging followers. Power is at the top but information is with the hands-on bottom levels of a hierarchy. There are some 20 gifts mentioned in Scripture (Romans 12, Ephesians 4, 1 Corinthians 1213). There s more news coming out. They also have two children together, whose name we don't know. The creep factor never ceases to amaze me. We experience the aftermath to this day. And yes I tend to paint with a broad brush because the structures and systems involved demand it. Some will sadly never make the decision to follow Christ. But long ago, I realized that these situations are not made up of clear white/black hats. Not just anyone can do it well. It means wearing Gods name like a banner (CHRIST-ian Leader) and then doing terribly ungodly things that represent Him poorly. http://www.dianelangberg.com/2018/04/dear-church/. The comments we disallow often have to do with abuse of victims along with some other things. Whats being destroyed is the idol worship of Bill Hybels. I think I hugged my coworker of ten years when he retired, Paul actually recommends we greet one another with a holy kiss.. And I never understood why Hybels did not step down when his wife (Lynne) had a HUGE crisis of faith. April 13, 2018. We got in deep, and had a very tough time when we got out. I guess Billy Graham never led anyone to Jesus then. More than we know. Bill has been married to Lynn Hybels since 1974. In 2018, sexual misconduct allegations had been alleged against Bill Hybels. Its the same thing my university wrings their hands over. The church is now thriving with new leadership, honoring Jesus instead of greedy indiscrete nepotism. Obviously very biblically ignorant site!! To choose to continue to take a medication in spite of those side effects, when there are so many other sleep aids available, makes no sense. No one walks away unascathed. Near the end of this article, Dee posted this question for Willow Creek Church: Is it possible that Bill Hybels encouraged the leadership of women in order to increase his own access to women who admired him within the confines of church business, giving him plausible deniability? Prestige of Willow Creek? @ ishy: You 2 probably believe Jesus was Jewish as well as all the disciples. I do not believe Jesus would have ever behaved the way you and John are acting. So, Am I over thinking it?, one wonders. Redemption. My assessment is that the entire leadership there at Willow Creek needs to be held accountable and the base must face this issue with appropriate consequences. Does anybody know how much hugging it takes to facilitate which feeling, assuming that the response is does related? So sad that we are talking about this within the context of the pulpit! To be in on developing and overseeing the budget? If Hybels had confessed an Ambien addiction with unlikely but serious side effects at the WC family meeting which had caused his occasional bad behavior around women staffers, he might have received a longer standing ovation. I guess you are not aware of the president for whom Hybels was a spiritual advisor. I also freely admit to hugging my cat till she meows at me to let her down. And whistleblowers are rarely the pristine good guys with no baggage. This morning, Nancy Ortberg posted Flawed Process, Wounded Women on her website. @ Lydia. and this they do with great skill. Not a wise thing to do. I mean, one post here put Hybels name next to Weinstiens. The door was open. Really? If I felt uncomfortable I removed myself from the situation and spoke up. Its been drilled into our heads and many are convinced if the perp or deceiver is confronted (even years later) they will repent. Again, the new york . One of the grandkids hugs on the yorkiepoo all the time. analytical thinking. Because your mind tells you this particular man YOU KNOW would never so you must be misjudging. But it is even harder when those left behind form a militia to hunt down and fire at anyone who dares to question the paradigm. Nothing to see here folksmove along! @ dee: By . Lets put all our conjecture up about the retracted affair as well. If nothing else, it is incredibly prideful of a person. Or been involved with the thought reform in a social justice Warrior Church. . People said the same sort of things about us, people sneered at us, shunned us, surely said Whats wrong with this picture just like you did. There are many Gods or gods. If you think they dont see our sin, you are fooling yourself. Uh oh..then we are in trouble. The exact same mind control tools create social justice Warrior Churches as are used to create mega seeker churches or the monolithic SBC franchise. Shameful! ), you come across as naive, profoundly ignorant. He needs nothing, needs none of us, but He loves us and makes us a part of His plan. I have seen it for over 20 years. And few of us agree on every point! By the time you get there, youve probably already been compromised yourself, youve supported a lot of evil things, youve shouted down others who were only trying to get at the truth (as I once did, alassorry, Adam, you were right and I was wrong, pastor really was up to no good), and its not easy to extricate yourself or your family. If the 21st century church had the same healthy respect for a literal hell that the 1st century church had, we might behave differently in and out of church including church leaders! That is a typical church response. Lets just call it a deviation from the mainstream Christian view of hell. But only a few. Ok. Ok. Bill Hybels confessed a few years ago that WC had made a mistake by not encouraging church members to read their Bibles and mature spiritually. My mom would come up to my room and cuddle while we talked when I was little and not so little. . Im probably talking to the air, though, because hit-and-run scolds like you seldom have the courage to come back. I also think if its true, it minimizes his and his wifes ability to legitimately point the finger at others, and the impact of their words, and that is very unfortunate. The accusations against Hybels come from multiple women, including several former employees who spoke on the record with the Chicago Tribune as a part of a major investigation published in March . If it doesnt recur, people often try to dismiss it as an aberration. Forgive, and you will be forgiven. Which God/god Bill ? Not that hugs are linked to drugs; I am just meandering. While still being married, Stephany accidentally reconnects with a former lover, who is hideously ugly and struggling nancially. Serving whom? Perhaps its just honest ignorance, perhaps its denial. Do you believe it is someone posing as her, or do you think she is in on it? Wild!!! Dave Dummitt Often, it is only after literally hundreds of these red flags have piled up and someone else mentions that they have this problem with something pastor said or did, that we finally go, What have I done? 3434 pant, right? But, still I try not to broad brush. Hybels, the influential founder and pastor willow creek, resigned in april 2018 after 42 years leading the church. Oh well. That this has to be explained in The Church is unbelievable. In a Facebook post shared over the weekend, a church member accused Dr. B. of kissing, fondling, and pressuring her with sex between 1984 and 1988. 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